MENU
Florida Chapter Officers
BOD Chairman
Nelson Montgomery
President
Dan Prater
1st Vice President
Ted Licitra
2nd Vice President
Mark Deegan
3rd Vice President
Richard Wheelus
Chaplain
Vince Dellacroce
Secretary
Joe DuPriest
Treasurer
Eric L Wasser
Parliamentarian
Tim Wright
Who's Online
1 registered (mcfs509), 1 Guest and 13 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
Spike, dsf, Christoper, Shawn M, Amarillas
517 Registered Users
Top Posters (30 Days)
Bryan Holland 8
Nick Sasso 5
Heinz R. 2
Mike Timpanaro 1
TerryR 1
SOwings 1
Christoper 1
Google Search
Today's Birthdays
No Birthdays
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#1419 - 12/15/04 01:16 PM Seal off inside panelboard
Mike Timpanaro Offline

Post-A-Holic Member
****

Registered: 04/10/01
Posts: 1104
Loc: Ocklawaha FL.
I have a large service panelboard at a BP gas station and convenience store. All the conduits from the island dispensers run back to the open bottom floor mounted service panelboard on the inside, and the seal off fittings are the first fittings located just above the concrete slab. I can't find a code section that would not permit this installation.

1. The panelboard is not an explosionproof enclosure.
2. The panelboard is located in an unclassified area.

What code section will I use to reject the seal off's for being inside the panelboard in article 500 and 501?
_________________________
Michael J Timpanaro
Inspector/Plans Examiner/CEU Instructor
Florida




Top
#1420 - 12/15/04 04:01 PM Re: Seal off inside panelboard
Nick Sasso Offline

Post-A-Holic Member
****

Registered: 11/08/01
Posts: 1451
Loc: West Palm Beach
Mike, I just got in from the field so I have to clean up and then I will go out and get my code book and take a stab on this one.

What is immediately coming to my mind is not in 500 or 501. It is somewhere in Switchboards and Panelboards. There can only be a 3" rise inside a switchboard or panelboard and I do believe that the code article stipulates that fittings are most definitely included in this measurement. You will have to double check me.

Just quick thinking. I could be wrong but that's my immediate thought. I will post back later as soon as I can.
_________________________

Top
#1421 - 12/15/04 05:35 PM Re: Seal off inside panelboard
Bryan Holland Offline

Secretary
*****

Registered: 10/05/04
Posts: 1622
Loc: City of North Port
I believe Nick is refering to Section 408.10
_________________________
Bryan P. Holland, MCP

Top
#1422 - 12/15/04 06:04 PM Re: Seal off inside panelboard
Nick Sasso Offline

Post-A-Holic Member
****

Registered: 11/08/01
Posts: 1451
Loc: West Palm Beach
Yup, that's the one. I just looked it up and it applies to switchboards, floor-standing panelboards, or similar enclosures. The seal off is a fitting so I would take a measure and if it is more than 3" rise inside the enclosure, then I would tag the job. It might be close, I don't know. Also keep in mind that the minimum wiring space (assuming insulated busbars) shall not be less than 8" from the bottom of the enclosure and bussbars, their supports, or other obstructions, so that is something that might apply.

I will start looking in 500 and 501 also.
_________________________

Top
#1423 - 12/15/04 07:25 PM Re: Seal off inside panelboard
Nick Sasso Offline

Post-A-Holic Member
****

Registered: 11/08/01
Posts: 1451
Loc: West Palm Beach
Well, I know I always say this, but first I would double check the approved set of plans. A gas station is usually done by an engineer who stamped the plans...see if the contractor complied with the approved drawing, or if he/she took it upon themselves to install the seal offs inside the panelboard on their own.

Then, I went to 500, 501 could find nothing.

Then, I went to 250 because the seal off fitting needs to be grounded in my opinion. 300.10 may also be useful. I don't think 250.86 would apply because one will argue that a seal off is not an enclosure or raceway. But, the term equipment by definition applies to fittings and, would not 250.110 condition 1 apply? I think this contractor screwed up because the only way to bond that fitting is with a short rigid nipple and a bonding bushing (MIG) and by that time they will exceed the 3" maximum rise.

Opinions....?


PS - (off the subject) Since this is a gas station a quick reminder to everyone that the car-vacs at gas stations usually have no listing whatsoever, so be sure to check for a listing at final inspection. A field listing may be in order.
_________________________

Top
#1424 - 12/16/04 06:34 AM Re: Seal off inside panelboard
Mike Timpanaro Offline

Post-A-Holic Member
****

Registered: 04/10/01
Posts: 1104
Loc: Ocklawaha FL.
Yep we agree about the 3" rise for the fittings in the panelboard, and the requirement for bonding. That is taken care of before final so they end up being ok.

But again, do we have a code section that would prohibit the seal off fittings from being inside the panelboard per article 500 or 501?

After much research I think that it’s ok.
_________________________
Michael J Timpanaro
Inspector/Plans Examiner/CEU Instructor
Florida




Top
#1425 - 12/16/04 02:15 PM Re: Seal off inside panelboard
Nick Sasso Offline

Post-A-Holic Member
****

Registered: 11/08/01
Posts: 1451
Loc: West Palm Beach
Mike I am trying to upload the photos you sent but my server is not responding at the moment so I will try again later.


question:
how are they bonding the seal offs?
_________________________

Top
#1426 - 12/16/04 08:02 PM Re: Seal off inside panelboard
Nick Sasso Offline

Post-A-Holic Member
****

Registered: 11/08/01
Posts: 1451
Loc: West Palm Beach
Here are some photos of the installation that Mike asked me to post:







_________________________

Top
#1427 - 12/17/04 06:51 AM Re: Seal off inside panelboard
Mike Timpanaro Offline

Post-A-Holic Member
****

Registered: 04/10/01
Posts: 1104
Loc: Ocklawaha FL.
A nipple will be installed with a bonding bushing and a bonding jumper.
_________________________
Michael J Timpanaro
Inspector/Plans Examiner/CEU Instructor
Florida




Top
#1428 - 12/17/04 06:43 PM Re: Seal off inside panelboard
Nick Sasso Offline

Post-A-Holic Member
****

Registered: 11/08/01
Posts: 1451
Loc: West Palm Beach
I'm still scrounging around for something in 514 to prevent this installation, but for now how about using 300.15(F)

?
_________________________

Top
Page 1 of 3 1 2 3 >



Active Topics
May Meeting Minutes
by Bryan Holland
Yesterday at 02:05 PM
May Meeting Announcement
by Bryan Holland
05/08/12 07:58 AM
Visual Alarms
by Nick Sasso
05/02/12 03:55 PM
Nonmetallic Extensions
by Nick Sasso
04/25/12 03:33 PM
Selective Coordination of Circuit Breakers
by Heinz R.
04/24/12 05:03 PM
May
M Tu W Th F Sa Su
1 2 3 4 5 6
7 8 9 10 11 12 13
14 15 16 17 18 19 20
21 22 23 24 25 26 27
28 29 30 31
Featured Member
Registered: 01/25/12
Posts: 0
Forum Stats
518 Members
29 Forums
1892 Topics
8569 Posts

Max Online: 53 @ 03/30/12 04:16 PM
Uploaded Pictures
Can You Spot The Electrical Violation?
1948 Signalite Fuse
Portable Generator Grounding
2011 Florida Gulf Coast Division - Seminar
Knob and tube in industrial application
1920's Duplex Radio Outlet
Random Gallery Image