MENU
Florida Chapter Officers
BOD Chairman
Nelson Montgomery
President
Dan Prater
1st Vice President
Ted Licitra
2nd Vice President
Mark Deegan
3rd Vice President
Richard Wheelus
Chaplain
Vince Dellacroce
Secretary
Joe DuPriest
Treasurer
Eric L Wasser
Parliamentarian
Tim Wright
Who's Online
1 registered (Ruben Rocha), 6 Guests and 2 Spiders online.
Key: Admin, Global Mod, Mod
Newest Members
onzevil1, beaing, ampherder, TonyLutziFlaRep, Jeff Sargent
507 Registered Users
Top Posters (30 Days)
Bryan Holland 12
Ruben Rocha 5
Nick Sasso 3
inspector32513 3
ronwampler 2
DickWidera 1
Google Search
Today's Birthdays
No Birthdays
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >
Topic Options
Rate This Topic
#6462 - 07/12/09 03:44 AM V/D and the NEC
gfretwell
Unregistered


We all know voltage drop is just a fine print note but there is a guy in this month's magazine advocating that it should be code. Any thoughts?

Top
#6463 - 07/12/09 09:08 AM Re: V/D and the NEC [Re: ]
John Desjardins Offline
Mechanic Member

Registered: 08/07/03
Posts: 306
Loc: Body=NC, Head & Heart=Florida
It is Code. Check Chapter 13 of the FBC. Has been for quite some time.
13-413.ABC.1 Voltage drop.

13-413.ABC.1.1 Feeders and customer-owned service conductors. Feeder and customer-owned service conductors shall be sized for a maximum voltage drop of 2 percent at design load.

13-413.ABC.1.2 Branch circuits. Branch circuit conductors shall be sized for a maximum voltage drop of 3 percent at design load.

I've been saying this for a long time. You need to stop thinking that the NEC is the Electrical Code for Florida. It is not. It is the Standard that we use. The Electrical Code is in the Florida Building Code. There is a lot of stuff there and if you haven't read it you've been missing a lot.

Look at Chapter 3,7,13 to start

Top
#6464 - 07/12/09 01:42 PM Re: V/D and the NEC [Re: John Desjardins]
gfretwell
Unregistered


I was really referring to the NEC in this case.

I do think Florida should get all the "electrical" things in the "electrical" chapter, just for simplicity but that is counter intuitive when you are talking about the government isn't it.

Top
#6465 - 07/12/09 05:18 PM Re: V/D and the NEC [Re: ]
Ruben Rocha Online   content

Senior Member
*****

Registered: 05/24/00
Posts: 764
Loc: Lutz,FL
Don't forget we have a energy code also.
And lest we forget the mechanical code that has some electrical requirements.
And ADA
And????
_________________________
Webmaster
IAEI Florida Chapter

Top
#6466 - 07/12/09 07:35 PM Re: V/D and the NEC [Re: Ruben Rocha]
John Desjardins Offline
Mechanic Member

Registered: 08/07/03
Posts: 306
Loc: Body=NC, Head & Heart=Florida
Yes I was siting the Energy Code above for V/D

Top
#6467 - 07/12/09 08:35 PM Re: V/D and the NEC [Re: John Desjardins]
Ruben Rocha Online   content

Senior Member
*****

Registered: 05/24/00
Posts: 764
Loc: Lutz,FL
Yea,it just goes on and on John.
The days of using just the NEC are gone today.
Just my opinion!
Also don't forget most AHJ's also use the UL White book.
OMG!!!! another reference
_________________________
Webmaster
IAEI Florida Chapter

Top
#6468 - 07/13/09 07:57 AM Re: V/D and the NEC [Re: Ruben Rocha]
Bryan Holland Offline

Secretary
*****

Registered: 10/05/04
Posts: 1599
Loc: City of North Port
I wouldn't mind VD becoming a mandatory requirement in the NEC as I do think it is important, however I am not sure it fits into the purpose of the code. Then again, there are many sections of the code which are not exactly a pure life and property safety requirement.

Perhaps they should split the code up into three general categories.

1. MUST DO
2. SHOULD DO
3. CAN DO

Maybe that isn't such a good idea...
_________________________
Bryan P. Holland, MCP

Top
#6471 - 07/13/09 01:51 PM Re: V/D and the NEC [Re: Bryan Holland]
gfretwell
Unregistered


I do believe Florida could incorporate all of these standards into one "electrical" code. I suppose we might eventually get used to looking in a half dozen books to size a feeder but that is certainly not the easy way to do it. When you add the 200 or so of separate interpretations the various AHJs have to the codes as written this is far from a uniform place for a contractor to work in. You need a GPS connected to your code book software to apply it.

Top
#6472 - 07/13/09 02:04 PM Re: V/D and the NEC [Re: ]
Rob Barbee Offline
Mechanic Member
***

Registered: 06/24/08
Posts: 120
Loc: Pinellas County
Originally Posted By: gfretwell
You need a GPS connected to your code book software to apply it.


The wheels are turning now! My million dollar idea! (or yours but I am stealing it!)
_________________________
Rob
Electrical Inspector

Top
#6475 - 07/13/09 10:49 PM Re: V/D and the NEC [Re: Rob Barbee]
gfretwell
Unregistered


This discussion does prompt an interesting question. How many of you require V/D calculations when plans are submitted?

Top
#6476 - 07/14/09 08:21 AM Re: V/D and the NEC [Re: ]
Bryan Holland Offline

Secretary
*****

Registered: 10/05/04
Posts: 1599
Loc: City of North Port
Originally Posted By: gfretwell
This discussion does prompt an interesting question. How many of you require V/D calculations when plans are submitted?


I do. In some cases, I will allow a general statement to be made about voltage drop on the plans if it does not appear any specific feeders or BC runs will be that long. It really has never been that much of an issue. Occasionally, you get a long homerun for feeders or a house circuit or perhpas parking lot lighting, but for the most part, VD is fairly limited by typical design.
_________________________
Bryan P. Holland, MCP

Top
#6477 - 07/14/09 09:31 AM Re: V/D and the NEC [Re: ]
psnorthrup Offline
Mechanic Member

Registered: 04/23/07
Posts: 115
Loc: Plant City
only when referenced in the plans or specs

Top
#6487 - 07/16/09 12:07 PM Re: V/D and the NEC [Re: psnorthrup]
gfretwell
Unregistered


It would be interesting to run V/D calcs on an HVAC condenser, sized to the nameplate minimum circuit ampacity.

Top
#6488 - 07/16/09 04:43 PM Re: V/D and the NEC [Re: ]
Ruben Rocha Online   content

Senior Member
*****

Registered: 05/24/00
Posts: 764
Loc: Lutz,FL
Well I can tell you that in my home. The building is a long narrow home that turns 90 degrees for the three car garage. L shaped home.
The panel is in the garage
I have never considered VD for a residence. Especially for a 2100 sq foot home.
But I can tell you I have a serious VD issue in the longest circuit.
Especially when my wife uses the hair dryer.
One of these days I will replace the home run from #12 with #10.
_________________________
Webmaster
IAEI Florida Chapter

Top
#6490 - 07/21/09 07:06 PM Re: V/D and the NEC [Re: ]
Ron Wampler Offline
Apprentice Member

Registered: 08/20/08
Posts: 43
Loc: Florida Keys
You get what you pay for...although it is heat loss (I*R) and definately should be in our energy code...You are all very knowledgable..

Top
#6493 - 07/22/09 10:38 AM Re: V/D and the NEC [Re: ]
Ron Wampler Offline
Apprentice Member

Registered: 08/20/08
Posts: 43
Loc: Florida Keys
V/D is I*R heat loss so I like seeing it in the energy code...I look at long runs with significant load for conductor sizing...my main concern with oversizing the circuit is to educate designers and contractors to additionally oversize the equipment grounding conductor as required in NEC 250-122; I see that as the real safety issue such as parking lot lighting runs...

Yes, all references and FBC form the requirements as in any discipline...

Top
Page 1 of 2 1 2 >



Active Topics
Moving site.
by Ruben Rocha
Yesterday at 06:43 PM
2010 FBC - Significant Changes (North Port List)
by Bryan Holland
02/01/12 01:22 PM
February Meeting Announcement
by Bryan Holland
02/01/12 01:21 PM
January Meeting Minutes
by Bryan Holland
02/01/12 01:20 PM
LISTING FOR SAUNA
by Nick Sasso
01/30/12 10:33 AM
February
M Tu W Th F Sa Su
1 2 3 4 5
6 7 8 9 10 11 12
13 14 15 16 17 18 19
20 21 22 23 24 25 26
27 28 29
Featured Member
Registered: 03/19/10
Posts: 0
Forum Stats
506 Members
29 Forums
1861 Topics
8491 Posts

Max Online: 32 @ 12/14/11 08:55 PM
Uploaded Pictures
Can You Spot The Electrical Violation?
1948 Signalite Fuse
Portable Generator Grounding
2011 Florida Gulf Coast Division - Seminar
Knob and tube in industrial application
1920's Duplex Radio Outlet
Random Gallery Image

Upcoming events