In regards to Bryan Hollands rhetorical question about not knowing if a product has been produced to a standard or standards, the listing process dictates that on the label containing the NRTL symbol ( i.e.- UL, ETL, MET, etc. ), that the Ansi/UL standard used for the manufacturing process be included on the label. Thus any label that does not contain reference to an ANSI/UL standard becomes very suspicious as to validity.

Dick, to the best of my knowledge some or most of the automatic teller machines we typically see at banks are still unlisted. Wachovia, now Wells Fargo, recently upgraded their ATM's. The new machines are incredible, allowing one to deposit cash or deposit checks without an envelope, scanning the checks and making them immediately viewable online (they always count the bills correctly, too). You can slide in up to 30 checks in one shot.

I wonder if these machines are listed?

Greetings all !

That warehouse full of A/C's with fake UL and ETL labeling takes another wierd twist. I have been informed by my sources that all of the units were manufactured in China. The sources were also adamant that the units did not arrive into Florida via a domestic seaport, truck, or rail. Also the USCustoms service never saw them.

The plot thickens.

That leaves the airport? Air Freight?

These counterfitter's are getting so good with their "craft" that I fear we no longer can be certain ANYTHING is what it appears to be.

It's hard enough for the legitimate manufacturer's to make a product that works well, holds up and performs in the manner it is intended and advertised. You know this fake stuff isn't going to up to par.

It really freaks me out a bit.

're the comment about airport on 06/28, the movement of the illicit goods into this country was indeed by air. However it was not to any airport operated by FAA rules ! The point of entry was an unmanned, remote air strip in South Florida.

Strange things are afoot in the State of Florida. This morning's "St. Pete Times" ran an article about a DOD computer theft of 3000 units from a facility in SE Tampa. Oddly enough the warehouse to which they were traced to was the same warehouse that I was in several weeks ago wherein there were the fake UL and ETL marked HVAC units. The DOD computers disappeared also from that SE Florida warehouse in a surreptitious manner.

Dick Widera

Dick:
A small correction. It is not an OSHA requirement that the standard to which the product was tested be included in the NRTL's certification Mark. Of course, the NRTL in question must have approval to test to the particular standard and that standard needs to be an ANSI standard, but it doesn't need to be part of the Certification Mark.
Also, the applicable standard is not a manufacturing standard, but a construction and performance standard.
Heinz R.

I agree with Heinz R. that OSHA does not require the conformity to statement on a NRTL label. Did I say that though ?

The listing requirements put forth to their clients by the various NRTLs do require that the appropriate standard to which the product is being manufactured, be included upon the marking label that includes the NRTL logo/symbol.

In several cases for my ETL clients, the listing standard is the manufacturing standard. This is not contrary to ANSI and OSHA requirments.

Things are still hot in South Florida with more counterfeit UL and ETL labeling coming in on products made in China. One party is threatening the FBI and USCustoms with a federal restraint of trade injunction. This has caused both of the agencies to back up a little bit to regroup their strategies of enforcement.

Dick W.

What? They are saying the government is "restraining the trade" of illegal products? Isn't that what we pay them to do?